DDD Forum :: View topic - 100 Greatest Rock Artists (under revision)

Echoes wrote:

Tears in Heaven was a huge song, but IMO it has not maintained its popularity over time, I mean, I don´t think you can say that Tears in Heaven is a “classic” rock song.
But from the side of Lennon you have Mother, Woman, Stand by Me, Power To the People, Give Peace a Chance, Karma Police, etc.

Radiohead did it better.

How is that crazy? If you are considering Layla as part of Clapton´s solo career, then you must also considered Lennon´s songs with The Beatles that are totally his like Julia, Come Together, Happiness, etc, etc, etc.

Ask most people about a John Lennon song and they will say Imagine. Ask the same question about Clapton and most people will have a really hard time naming one of his songs.

ClashWho wrote:

Echoes wrote:

Radiohead did it better.

Oh you picked on that one.

I did it on purpose to show Lennon´s influence.

Johnny wrote:

Echoes wrote:

I know that he sold more records, but Clapton doesn’t have a song as popular as Imagine. Also, Lennon is better known and more iconic than Clapton (IMO that is popularity).

So maybe a tie is better?

What about Tears In Heaven? That song is just as classic as Imagine. Wonderful Tonight is also very known.

And Clapton is widely considered one of THE best guitar players ever. That is a big thing.

Echoes wrote:

ClashWho wrote:

Echoes wrote:

Radiohead did it better.

Oh you picked on that one.

I did it on purpose to show Lennon´s influence.

That's a little far fetched, there's just a common word in the title.

Echoes wrote:

Johnny wrote:

Echoes wrote:

What about Tears In Heaven? That song is just as classic as Imagine. Wonderful Tonight is also very known.

And Clapton is widely considered one of THE best guitar players ever. That is a big thing.

Tears In Heaven is a HUGE song. Definitely one of the most recognizable of the last 20 years. I know Grammys kinda suck, but it won 3 of those. I think Imagine is just as famous as tears in heaven in a mainstream audience. And all the other songs you mentioned aren't that famous at all. They don't reach the level of his Beatles' compositions. Except maybe Give Peace a Chance. And Stand By Me, which still isn't as famous or iconic as the one by Ben E. King.

I think is ok to quote external sources. On Rolling Stone's list of "The 500 Greatest Songs of All Time", Imagine is #3, Tears in Heaven is #362.

Karma Police is influenced by Sexy Sadie (which is 100% Lennon´s).

ClashWho wrote:

Echoes wrote:

But Layla is from Derek and the Dominos and that song in particular have a huge input from Allman and Jim Gordon (who wrote the final part of the song), so I think it should not be considered as part of Clapton´s solo career.

That's crazy.

The fact that there was only one Derek & The Dominoes album makes it difficult to make a case for excluding it.

Gray wrote:

The fact that there was only one Derek & The Dominoes album makes it difficult to make a case for excluding it.

Plus there's the (safe) assumption that Derek = Eric.

Let's do this.

Eric Clapton
Aerosmith
Radiohead
AC/DC
The Eagles
Fleetwood Mac
Eric B. and Rakim
Al Green
Crosby, Stills, & Nash (& Young)
The Clash
Bob Marley & the Wailers
Joni Mitchell
Janet Jackson
The Clovers
Roy Brown

Rank 'em, 1-15. Specifically, pull out the artists which are clearly the "greatest", which are clearly the "least great", and which groups are pretty similar.

I mean, if you can't at least convincingly put those artists in general groups, you can't really come in and give an argument for one specific artist.

Author:	Echoes [ Fri May 11, 2012 2:18 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: 100 Greatest Rock Artists (under revision)
ClashWho wrote: Echoes wrote: Tears in Heaven was a huge song, but IMO it has not maintained its popularity over time, I mean, I don´t think you can say that Tears in Heaven is a “classic” rock song. But from the side of Lennon you have Mother, Woman, Stand by Me, Power To the People, Give Peace a Chance, Karma Police, etc. Radiohead did it better. Oh you picked on that one. I did it on purpose to show Lennon´s influence.

Author:	ClashWho [ Fri May 11, 2012 2:41 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: 100 Greatest Rock Artists (under revision)
Echoes wrote: How is that crazy? If you are considering Layla as part of Clapton´s solo career, then you must also considered Lennon´s songs with The Beatles that are totally his like Julia, Come Together, Happiness, etc, etc, etc. Nah, they don't appear on John Lennon compilations like "Layla" does on Eric Clapton hits collections. Echoes wrote: Ask most people about a John Lennon song and they will say Imagine. Ask the same question about Clapton and most people will have a really hard time naming one of his songs. Not in my experience.

Author:	McMurphy [ Fri May 11, 2012 3:01 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: 100 Greatest Rock Artists (under revision)
Echoes wrote: ClashWho wrote: Echoes wrote: Tears in Heaven was a huge song, but IMO it has not maintained its popularity over time, I mean, I don´t think you can say that Tears in Heaven is a “classic” rock song. But from the side of Lennon you have Mother, Woman, Stand by Me, Power To the People, Give Peace a Chance, Karma Police, etc. Radiohead did it better. Oh you picked on that one. I did it on purpose to show Lennon´s influence. That's a little far fetched, there's just a common word in the title.

Author:	Johnny [ Fri May 11, 2012 3:33 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: 100 Greatest Rock Artists (under revision)
Echoes wrote: Johnny wrote: Echoes wrote: I know that he sold more records, but Clapton doesn’t have a song as popular as Imagine. Also, Lennon is better known and more iconic than Clapton (IMO that is popularity). So maybe a tie is better? What about Tears In Heaven? That song is just as classic as Imagine. Wonderful Tonight is also very known. And Clapton is widely considered one of THE best guitar players ever. That is a big thing. Tears in Heaven was a huge song, but IMO it has not maintained its popularity over time, I mean, I don´t think you can say that Tears in Heaven is a “classic” rock song. But from the side of Lennon you have Mother, Woman, Stand by Me, Power To the People, Give Peace a Chance, Karma Police, etc. Lennon is considered one of the greatest vocalists in rock history. So again, IMO they are peers. Tears In Heaven is a HUGE song. Definitely one of the most recognizable of the last 20 years. I know Grammys kinda suck, but it won 3 of those. I think Imagine is just as famous as tears in heaven in a mainstream audience. And all the other songs you mentioned aren't that famous at all. They don't reach the level of his Beatles' compositions. Except maybe Give Peace a Chance. And Stand By Me, which still isn't as famous or iconic as the one by Ben E. King.

Author:	Echoes [ Fri May 11, 2012 4:18 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: 100 Greatest Rock Artists (under revision)
McMurphy wrote: Echoes wrote: ClashWho wrote: Echoes wrote: Tears in Heaven was a huge song, but IMO it has not maintained its popularity over time, I mean, I don´t think you can say that Tears in Heaven is a “classic” rock song. But from the side of Lennon you have Mother, Woman, Stand by Me, Power To the People, Give Peace a Chance, Karma Police, etc. Radiohead did it better. Oh you picked on that one. I did it on purpose to show Lennon´s influence. That's a little far fetched, there's just a common word in the title. Karma Police is influenced by Sexy Sadie (which is 100% Lennon´s).

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Author:	Echoes [ Fri May 11, 2012 4:21 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: 100 Greatest Rock Artists (under revision)
Johnny wrote: Echoes wrote: Johnny wrote: Echoes wrote: I know that he sold more records, but Clapton doesn’t have a song as popular as Imagine. Also, Lennon is better known and more iconic than Clapton (IMO that is popularity). So maybe a tie is better? What about Tears In Heaven? That song is just as classic as Imagine. Wonderful Tonight is also very known. And Clapton is widely considered one of THE best guitar players ever. That is a big thing. Tears in Heaven was a huge song, but IMO it has not maintained its popularity over time, I mean, I don´t think you can say that Tears in Heaven is a “classic” rock song. But from the side of Lennon you have Mother, Woman, Stand by Me, Power To the People, Give Peace a Chance, Karma Police, etc. Lennon is considered one of the greatest vocalists in rock history. So again, IMO they are peers. Tears In Heaven is a HUGE song. Definitely one of the most recognizable of the last 20 years. I know Grammys kinda suck, but it won 3 of those. I think Imagine is just as famous as tears in heaven in a mainstream audience. And all the other songs you mentioned aren't that famous at all. They don't reach the level of his Beatles' compositions. Except maybe Give Peace a Chance. And Stand By Me, which still isn't as famous or iconic as the one by Ben E. King. I think is ok to quote external sources. On Rolling Stone's list of "The 500 Greatest Songs of All Time", Imagine is #3, Tears in Heaven is #362.

Author:	Bruno [ Fri May 11, 2012 4:29 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: 100 Greatest Rock Artists (under revision)
Echoes wrote: I think is ok to quote external sources. On Rolling Stone's list of "The 500 Greatest Songs of All Time", Imagine is #3, Tears in Heaven is #362. This is a joke. I mean, Imagine can be top 10, but Tears in Heaven is top 40-60.

Author:	ClashWho [ Fri May 11, 2012 4:44 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: 100 Greatest Rock Artists (under revision)
Echoes wrote: I think is ok to quote external sources. On Rolling Stone's list of "The 500 Greatest Songs of All Time", Imagine is #3, Tears in Heaven is #362. Considering the number of songs in contention, that's practically a tie.

Author:	McMurphy [ Fri May 11, 2012 4:55 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: 100 Greatest Rock Artists (under revision)
Quote: Karma Police is influenced by Sexy Sadie (which is 100% Lennon´s). Yes, but that's a Beatles' song, not A John Lennon song. So it doesn't count

Author:	Echoes [ Fri May 11, 2012 5:02 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: 100 Greatest Rock Artists (under revision)

Author:	Brett Alan [ Fri May 11, 2012 8:14 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: 100 Greatest Rock Artists (under revision)
Echoes wrote: ClashWho wrote: Echoes wrote: But Layla is from Derek and the Dominos and that song in particular have a huge input from Allman and Jim Gordon (who wrote the final part of the song), so I think it should not be considered as part of Clapton´s solo career. That's crazy. How is that crazy? If you are considering Layla as part of Clapton´s solo career, then you must also considered Lennon´s songs with The Beatles that are totally his like Julia, Come Together, Happiness, etc, etc, etc. I think it would be more accurate to say that if Derek & The Dominoes isn't part of Clapton's solo career, then the Plastic Ono Band isn't part of Lennon's solo career. Lennon's Beatles songs would be more equivalent to Clapton's spotlight songs with Cream. I think "Layla" and "Tears In Heaven" are huge, and if you want to talk lasting popularity, "Wonderful Tonight" has probably gotten more radio airplay over the last 30 or so years than any Lennon song.

Author:	Gray [ Fri May 11, 2012 8:20 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: 100 Greatest Rock Artists (under revision)
The fact that there was only one Derek & The Dominoes album makes it difficult to make a case for excluding it.

Author:	McMurphy [ Fri May 11, 2012 8:21 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: 100 Greatest Rock Artists (under revision)
This discussion actually isn't even worth having. John Lennon isn't even in the top 100 by Brian's calculations, and he's not that close. If Echoes wants to make a case for Lennon being in the top 100 he'd be better suited comparing him to Janis Joplin, the Velvet Underground, or someone else at the tail end of the list, not someone almost in the top 50. And obviously he shouldn't make claims that Lennon is more popular.

Author:	Eric Wood [ Fri May 11, 2012 9:07 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: 100 Greatest Rock Artists (under revision)
Gray wrote: The fact that there was only one Derek & The Dominoes album makes it difficult to make a case for excluding it. Plus there's the (safe) assumption that Derek = Eric. Let's do this. Eric Clapton Aerosmith Radiohead AC/DC The Eagles Fleetwood Mac Eric B. and Rakim Al Green Crosby, Stills, & Nash (& Young) The Clash Bob Marley & the Wailers Joni Mitchell Janet Jackson The Clovers Roy Brown Rank 'em, 1-15. Specifically, pull out the artists which are clearly the "greatest", which are clearly the "least great", and which groups are pretty similar. I mean, if you can't at least convincingly put those artists in general groups, you can't really come in and give an argument for one specific artist.

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Author:	McMurphy [ Fri May 11, 2012 9:13 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: 100 Greatest Rock Artists (under revision)
Eric Wood wrote: Gray wrote: The fact that there was only one Derek & The Dominoes album makes it difficult to make a case for excluding it. Plus there's the (safe) assumption that Derek = Eric. Let's do this. Eric Clapton Aerosmith Radiohead AC/DC The Eagles Fleetwood Mac Eric B. and Rakim Al Green Crosby, Stills, & Nash (& Young) The Clash Bob Marley & the Wailers Joni Mitchell Janet Jackson The Clovers Roy Brown Rank 'em, 1-15. Specifically, pull out the artists which are clearly the "greatest", which are clearly the "least great", and which groups are pretty similar. I mean, if you can't at least convincingly put those artists in general groups, you can't really come in and give an argument for one specific artist. How about you do that instead.