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Last Album You Listened To (And Rate It)
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Author:  Dreww [ Thu Jan 06, 2011 2:34 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Last Album You Listened To (And Rate It)

I respect Pangaea/Agharta and I don't think they're shit or anything, I just would rather listen to so much other stuff. Same goes for Live-Evil. Bitches Brew though I kind of just don't like.

Author:  Georgi [ Thu Jan 06, 2011 2:41 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Last Album You Listened To (And Rate It)

I've never liked Bitches Brew. I've tried hard, but I just don't. Definitely my least favourite of the big jazz albums.

Author:  SanTropez [ Thu Jan 06, 2011 3:38 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Last Album You Listened To (And Rate It)

Parliament - Funkentelechy vs.the Placebo Syndrome

10/10

Link to my review:

viewtopic.php?f=39&t=1396&p=53521#p53521

Author:  pnoom [ Thu Jan 06, 2011 5:57 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Last Album You Listened To (And Rate It)

jj
kills: 5

Image

On their single Let Them (which appears here, in modified form, as Kill Them), jj achieved something magical. Lyrically, the song makes a pass at being a hip-hop swag track: “fuck all you hoes,” “haters gonna hate,” “let them snitch, let them be, let them die.” Melodically, however, the hip-hop beat is overwhelmed by the airy vocals and gorgeous atmosphere. It doesn’t sound like a typical self-hyping track. A closer look at the lyrics reveals that self-doubt does creep in. The odd phrasing of some lines, e.g. “guess I’ll have to show/I’m somebody you should know,” “it ain’t my fault they at the bottom,” and “I wish you scary shit/that make you run, make you hide,” reveals that the group consists of outsiders tentatively trying their hand. That innocence and sweetness behind the braggadocio makes up a lot of the band’s charm, and helps make Let Them their best song to date.

Before Let Them came out as a single, jj frequently hinted at this aspect of their character. Their first release, jj n° 1, consisted of two songs, My Life, My Swag and My Swag, My Life. Ecstasy from jj n° 2 reinvents Lil Wayne’s Lollipop. And My Way, the B-side to the Let Go single, even has Lil Wayne rapping on it. Their new mixtape, Kills, however, is the first time they’ve fully devoted themselves to plundering hip-hop to form the basis of their songs. Every song here prominently samples hip-hop tracks (generally recent ones), including quoting many lyrics.

Kills opens with Still, the song on the album that most sounds like older jj (along with Kill Them), making it a good choice for an opener. Their beautiful female vocals float above a sample of Dr. Dre’s “Still D.R.E.,” enchantingly dropping lines like “get drunk, get crunk, get fucked up,” which exploits the same opposition that propels Kill Them. It’s an introduction that shows the band’s charm in full force. The rest of the mixtape pushes in a newer direction, building off the foundation Still provides. On Die Tonight, they open with solo vocals that go heavy on autotune and echo effects, swiping lyrics from Robyn’s Hang With Me before turning (briefly) into a near-straight cover of Taio Cruz’s Dynamite. Massive overlistening of top 40 radio this summer (largely not by choice) has ruined what little appeal that song had for me, making me wish they had chosen a different song, but it does work for what it is. In any case, the song soon veers into more expansive territory for the closing section, which includes a sample of strings from Lil Wayne’s 3 Peat (I think) that fade in and out. It’s a much better example of reappropriation than the middle section, I think.

The whole mixtape, for the most part, is an exercise in such reappropriation, and this peaks on the next two songs. Kill Them and Kill You form a connected set. Kill Them, described above, samples Akon’s Right Now (Na Na Na), a “let’s get back together” song. jj cleverly swipe lyrics from Akon, turning a remorseful admission of having “said some things that weren’t true” to an accusation impugning the honesty of the group’s haters. The haters remain unnamed, a vague grouping of people connected only by an opinion. Kill You marks the opposite trend. It heavily samples M.I.A.’s Paper Planes (which I find amusing given M.I.A.’s heavy sampling of The Clash to make that song), a song every bit as vague in its condemnations as Kill Them. As the name Kill You suggests, however, Kill You is a much more personal song than its predecessor, attacking a lover. Immediately after turning a personal song into a vague attack, jj turn around and do the opposite in one of the best touches on Kills. It’s this sort of trick that sets Kills apart as being more than mere plundering.

jj continues running through hip-hop tropes with New Work, reminiscing about the good old days on top of a sample of Jay-Z’s Empire State of Mind. Like Kill Them, jj adopts a typical hip-hop stance, but their strange phrasing (“we were kings of the street/not yet beaten by defeats”) reveals their outsider status. This doesn’t always work, though, as on the next song, Believe which recycles lyrical clichés much less convincingly than Kill Them or New Work, mostly because it lacks personality. The band adds nothing of their own to the theme of love being like a drug (hey Ke$ha), so the song just sounds like an anonymous version of that theme. For an album that relies so heavily on taking the work of others and making it one’s own, anonymity is a huge flaw, and it makes Believe the album’s weakest track.

Luckily, Pressure is a Privilege rights the ship. It heavily samples Dr. Dre’s Under Pressure, largely letting the song stand alone, interspersing some new vocals between the verses. The claustrophobic beat perfectly complements these sparse additions, which add just enough to assert the band’s personality, but mostly let the original song speak for itself. It’s the most overtly hip-hop song on the album because the original verses are included, and it provides good variety.

Just like Kill You and Kill Them make the most sense in the context of one another, the closing stretch of the album is unified. In this case, the theme is appreciation for and deference to Kanye’s new album, My Beautiful Dark Twisted Fantasy. Angels starts with a sample unrelated to Kanye, but includes the line, “who will survive in America/we survived in America,” a clear reference to Gil Scott-Heron’s contribution to Kanye’s album. The lyrical theme of the song in general is presenting themselves as gifts from the gods, which may or may not be a reference to Kanye’s ego.

With Boom, jj start sampling Kanye musically, twisting around Kanye’s Power. As the title suggests, Boom is the most upfront song on the album musically. Lyrically, it’s short and to the point: “K. West is a master/if we fast he is faster/fuck with us it’s disaster/motherfucker, fuck with us it’s disaster.” After a slower coda, Boom segues into High End, which samples both Dark Fantasy and Runaway from My Beautiful Dark Twisted Fantasy, with the only lyrics being, “can we get much higher,” drawn from Dark Fantasy. Thematically, it’s fitting that jj end this way. As hip-hop plunderers, it makes sense that they’d show deference to Kanye, whose new album was a monumental event for hip-hop (though I personally don’t like it).

As a work of reappropriation, jj’s Kills ranks up with the best such albums (Believe aside). However, their greatest strength has always been their melodic sense. Kastlander has a beautiful voice, and mixing it with airy melodies makes for most of the band’s best moments. At times, e.g. Still and Kill Them, this strength is in full display. Unfortunately, the album sometimes falters here. Believe, in addition to being weak lyrically, suffers from having a weak vocal melody. Moreover, while it’s understandable that jj wouldn’t want to add too many of their own vocals to a section showing deference to Kanye West, the closing stretch really suffers from a lack of strong melodies. That makes it much easier for me to appreciate that stretch than to enjoy it. At its best, Kills reinvigorates jj after the lackluster jj n° 3, but I don’t see myself giving it many full listens in the future.

Author:  Dreww [ Thu Jan 06, 2011 9:54 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Last Album You Listened To (And Rate It)

I don't really expect anyone else to like this as much as me because it has my name all over it; I really like all the music they sample and love what they do with it more than the original in every instance I can think of, getting rid of all the parts of the songs that kept me from LOVING the originals, while also either adding better melodies on top of it, or improving the phrasing/delivery of the original melody. I also love the fact that that the whole album just feels like an unpredictable stew of pot-drenched awesome and free-association--most sampling in music comes across as either just a kind of almost brick-like collage (Girl Talk, The Avalanches) or the way blues players built their songs around melodies they used over and over (most hip-hop and what jj have done on their albums). With jj's Kills, for the first time I know we're getting sampling that seems to occur organically out of their distinct sensibility, the way that folk tune appears out of nowhere in Albert Ayler's "Ghosts" or something, from a bunch of cacophonous expression, as if it always just existed that way in time and all the artist had to do was give expression to it. As for your review, it's really detailed and well-written and insightful about possible conceptual themes that may or may not underly their motivation for sampling this or that (which, at least for me, is the least interesting aspect of their music) but it doesn't seem to justify the low rating. The review seems like you really like the album but that "Believe", a 2 minute interlude, is a low point, and that you don't like that they cover Taio Cruz's "Dynamite". Are those really such fatal flaws?

Author:  jumpman8828 [ Thu Jan 06, 2011 10:00 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Last Album You Listened To (And Rate It)

I feel you Drew :wink:

Author:  pave [ Thu Jan 06, 2011 11:08 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Last Album You Listened To (And Rate It)

Dreww wrote:
Tudwell wrote:
Not exactly an album, but the other day a friend of mine threw on a DVD from some Bitches Brew deluxe set thing, which contained an hour long video of a live jam/concert by Miles Davis and co. I guess I'd give it a 0/10, cause it was probably the worst music I've ever heard. I really have no idea the appeal this type of music has for some people.

The majority of Davis's stuff after In a Silent Way is nonsensical failed experiments imo. I still kind of like On the Corner though, and I guess parts of Jack Johnson. Kind of Blue is still my favorite. Milestones and Sketches of Spain after that.


i couldn't disagree more with this. imo that's the peak of his brilliance. particularly the two you mentioned- On the Corner and JJ.

Author:  pnoom [ Thu Jan 06, 2011 11:31 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Last Album You Listened To (And Rate It)

Dreww wrote:
I don't really expect anyone else to like this as much as me because it has my name all over it; I really like all the music they sample and love what they do with it more than the original in every instance I can think of, getting rid of all the parts of the songs that kept me from LOVING the originals, while also either adding better melodies on top of it, or improving the phrasing/delivery of the original melody. I also love the fact that that the whole album just feels like an unpredictable stew of pot-drenched awesome and free-association--most sampling in music comes across as either just a kind of almost brick-like collage (Girl Talk, The Avalanches) or the way blues players built their songs around melodies they used over and over (most hip-hop and what jj have done on their albums). With jj's Kills, for the first time I know we're getting sampling that seems to occur organically out of their distinct sensibility, the way that folk tune appears out of nowhere in Albert Ayler's "Ghosts" or something, from a bunch of cacophonous expression, as if it always just existed that way in time and all the artist had to do was give expression to it.

I agree, I like all of this about it (though I disagree with your critique of the Avalanches). But...

Quote:
As for your review, it's really detailed and well-written and insightful about possible conceptual themes that may or may not underly their motivation for sampling this or that (which, at least for me, is the least interesting aspect of their music) but it doesn't seem to justify the low rating. The review seems like you really like the album but that "Believe", a 2 minute interlude, is a low point, and that you don't like that they cover Taio Cruz's "Dynamite". Are those really such fatal flaws?

I really skimped on talking about the flaws, but I really don't care for the closing three songs either. Biggie's verse they use is pretty braindead on Angels, I thought, and just in general I don't think they added much to what Kanye did at the end. They added some, but not enough. So even though I like those songs conceptually, actually listening to them I don't enjoy much. I really, really admire Kills conceptually, and that's what I spent most of my time talking about because that's what's really invigorating about it, and what I have interesting things to say. When it comes to specific melodies, I rarely have more to say than "I liked it" or "I disliked it," which is why all of my main critiques in that regard were stuffed into a single paragraph.

And keep in mind that in my rating system, 5 means "ok." So it's not at all like I dislike the album. I think it has some great merits, but also some parts that are interesting to think about but not really to listen to (and then Believe, which I just don't care for at all). Also, I didn't find a place where I could put it in my review and have it fit, but I think that the differences between Kill Them and the single version Let Them significantly detract from the back half of the song. The single version is much better IMO.

Author:  Dreww [ Thu Jan 06, 2011 11:36 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Last Album You Listened To (And Rate It)

Fair enough. For me it doesn't matter that they didn't add a whole lot to the Kanye samples (though I do think the adding of the Inception boom is significant) because sometimes improving something has more to do with what you have taken away and condensed it down to rather than what you have thrown on top of it.

Author:  pnoom [ Thu Jan 06, 2011 11:44 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Last Album You Listened To (And Rate It)

Even if I'm underestimating how much they added to the Kanye samples, and I very well might be, what it comes down to is that I just plain don't enjoy listening to it all that much, and would've liked it more if they had really focused on writing some strong new vocal melodies to go on top. The same is minorly true of some songs I didn't mention in this regard, like New Work, where I think the vocals they add have a fine melody but not a great one.

Author:  pnoom [ Mon Jan 10, 2011 5:36 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Last Album You Listened To (And Rate It)

Leonard Cohen
I'm Your Man: Image (very good)

Image

In light of the recent trend of modern bands adopting the 80s aesthetic in their music, it’s worth going back and looking at attempts by musicians of the 60s and 70s to adopt the 80s sound. Those of the progressive rock bands of the early 70s were generally disastrous, but there were success stories as well (such as New Order, doubly impressive because they had just lost Ian Curtis to suicide). Leonard Cohen’s I’m Your Man is one of the most successful adoptions of the 80s aesthetic by an older musician.

For those who’re only familiar with Cohen’s albums from the late 60s and early 70s will undoubtedly be surprised (and probably turned off, at least initially) by Cohen’s enthusiastic embrace of schmaltz. Once you get past the initial shock, however, Cohen’s stylistic decisions on I’m Your Man make sense. His voice is much deeper than on previous albums, and this is complemented by full-bodied atmosphere, which is more fleshed out than on previous albums (not that they’re lacking in this department). Moreover, the same lyrical depth and songwriting ability that he’s know for are in full force here.

I’m Your Man opens defiantly with First We Take Manhattan, a menacing song that immediately throws you into the over the top 80s production. Cohen’s deep voice sings lyrics that plot the recapturing of Manhattan and Berlin from greed-driven developers. Behind the seriousness is Cohen’s sense of humor. The plotting of the verses is interspersed with female choruses that adds an almost offhand element of love into the mix. More than that, the weapons of choice for our revolutionary? “And thank you for those items that you sent me / The monkey and the plywood violin / I practiced every night and now I'm ready / First we take Manhattan, then we take Berlin.” Combine those lyrics with the cover art—Leonard Cohen eating banana in a suit—and you can see a tongue-in-cheek undercurrent to the album. Cohen may be singing about doom and gloom, but he’s wearing a sloppy grin while he does it.

That doesn’t prevent Cohen from addressing serious themes, however. Everybody Knows takes on love in light of the AIDS epidemic, talking about how a “plague is coming,” focusing on being faithful “give or take a night or two,” and comparing sex to rolling dice that “everybody knows” are loaded. Behind these lyrics are a slow beat, ominous strings, and some excellent acoustic guitar, which combine to give the song a slightly unsettling feel that befits the lyrics. On Tower of Song, the excellent closer, Cohen examines himself as a songwriter, concluding, “I was born like this, I had no choice, I was born with the gift of a golden voice, and 27 angels from the great beyond, they tied my to this table right here in the tower of song.” That’s just one of many great passages in the song, one of Cohen’s most moving (though it isn’t in the same class as Suzanne and Hallelujah). It’s much more toned-down than First We Take Manhattan, and together the two form a fabulous set of bookends for the album.

One of the most clearly humorous songs on the album is Jazz Police, which is also one of the most polarizing. A friend of mine who loves Leonard Cohen and I’m Your Man finds it atrocious. It’s not hard to see why he reacts this way to it. Cohen incorporates the 80s to an even greater extreme than on the rest of the album. Sections as upfront as First We Take Manhattan contrast almost grotesquely with the female chorus, and towards the end there’s a keyboard solo that’s hard to take seriously. Nevertheless, while it’s certainly not a highlight of the album, I can’t help but find the song strangely compelling. It works in context.

The only time the sound of the album really gets in the way of enjoying the music for me is the beginning of Ain’t No Cure for Love, where smooth jazz saxophone is employed without much respect for taste (perhaps that’s why the jazz police are searching Cohen’s folders). While such saxophone can be incorporated well into serious music (as can be seen throughout Destroyer’s Kaputt, one of the best recent albums mining the 80s), it just doesn’t work on Ain’t No Cure for Love. That’s a fairly minor flaw, however, lasting for only the first 30 seconds of the song, the rest of which is much better. Altogether, I’m Your Man is a consistently great album that provides a good blueprint for how to incorporate ostensively cheesy production into serious music.

Author:  Nick [ Thu Jan 13, 2011 1:25 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Last Album You Listened To (And Rate It)

michael jackson - dangerous high tier? Never heard the album from start to finish, just the singles from it, but the general consensus was that it was pretty mediocre. Can you expand on high tier, mitch?

Author:  wantabodylikeme [ Fri Jan 14, 2011 12:06 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Last Album You Listened To (And Rate It)

wrote a kaputt review for me and dddchat's new blog

http://peoplewhostareatrugs.blogspot.com/

Author:  Avery_Island [ Fri Jan 14, 2011 12:18 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Last Album You Listened To (And Rate It)

Merzbow - 1930.

Umm, yeah. That's quite enough of that.

Author:  pnoom [ Fri Jan 14, 2011 3:08 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Last Album You Listened To (And Rate It)

Leonard Cohen
Songs of Love and Hate:Image (ok)

Image

Leonard Cohen had the misfortune of releasing a debut so good that every later album of his was doomed to sit in its shadow. I’m Your Man somewhat escapes this, mostly by sounding completely different, but that’s really it. His third album, Songs of Love and Hate, definitely invites comparisons to his debut, relying on similar guitar playing and having a similar overall sound. Unfortunately, those comparisons don’t stack up in its favor.

Songs of Love and Hate starts incredibly promisingly with Avalanche. “Well, I stepped into an avalanche / it covered up my soul,” begins Cohen, slowly unfurling a deeply bitter reproach to a lover who takes advantage of him. It’s a dark, unsettling song, perfectly setting the tone for the rest of the album, which might be his bleakest effort. Cohen’s insistent picking and deep voice create a palpable sense of hatred, but he never loses control. A seething tension lies beneath the controlled exterior, and the result is my favorite Cohen song.

After that, though, the album takes a dip. Last Year’s Man and Dress Rehearsal Rag are both solid songs, but neither rank among his best. Last Year’s Man begins to drag on after a while, lacking the necessary variation to sustain my interest, especially since it continues the same atmosphere as Avalanche, but not nearly as compellingly. Dress Rehearsal Rag is slightly punchier and gives the album some much-needed energy, and it’s one of the better songs on the album, though not quite top-tier Cohen.

Things really go awry with Diamonds in the Mine, where Cohen adopts a strained, forced vocal style that simply doesn’t sound good. Diamonds in the Mine is the most active song on the album, and it’s understandable why Cohen would want some energy at this point in the album, but the song just feels completely out of place, not fitting with the songs around it. As both a bad song and an ill-fitting song, it’s a giant blight on the album.

For better or for worse, Cohen never really picks up the energy again on the album’s second half. This means that there are no more botched experiments like Diamonds in the Mine, but it also results in the album beginning to sound monotonous. Love Calls You By Your Name and Joan of Arc are rather faceless tracks. They sound like Leonard Cohen songs, but they never really go beyond that, and within a minute of them ending, I can hardly remember a thing about them. This, combined with the fact that they’re low-energy songs, causes Songs of Love and Hate to start dragging throughout the second half.

The exception to this is Famous Blue Raincoat, the one song on the album that can go toe to toe with Avalanche. While it maintains the same sound and dark atmosphere of the rest of the album, Cohen’s lyrics set it apart. Written as a letter to someone with whom one of Cohen’s lovers was unfaithful, by the time Cohen gets to the ending, “Sincerely, L. Cohen,” he’s explored the crevices and ambiguities of a love triangle. “Thanks, for the trouble you took from her eyes / I thought it was there for good so I never tried,” he sings, and it’s difficult to tell whether he’s serious or sarcastic.

While not a bad album, Songs of Love and Hate ultimately is just plain boring if I try and sit straight through it. It spends most of its time plodding through almost torturously slow songs that are mostly fine in isolation, but become too much when strung together. The one attempt to break out of this mold, Diamonds in the Mine, is an abject failure. Avalanche and Famous Blue Raincoat are absolutely essential listening, good enough that they make the album worth hearing. After a couple of listens to the whole album, however, I’ve found myself returning to those two songs exclusively.

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