Most Influential Rock Artists

Nick · **Posted:** Sun Dec 05, 2010 7:54 am

What in god's name is going on in here?! Can you all take your genetics 101 class elsewhere? Grazi.

gminer · **Joined:** Mon Oct 11, 2010 6:17 pm **Posts:** 2949

Bruce wrote:

gminer wrote:

.. you generally have no idea what you are talking about ... other than your premise is incorrect and your examples do not prove anything in regards to your "black singing voice" theory ..... Take care

You generally and specifically have your head up your arse. Genetics certainly play a part in voices. That's why singers from the same family can sing harmonies (Mills Brothers, Everly Brothers) that can't be done by singers who are not related.

When you show me a white guy who can sing like Howlin' Wolf we'll talk.

needed to do that to get to get a sense of your daily environment ...... so based on your generalizations and stereotyping all blacks would sound the same and all whites would sound the same because of a genetic marker that is unique to people of different skin colours for their singing voice ...... a trained black opera singer would always sound black and easily distinguishable from their white counterpart .... it is, after all, and according to you, genetic in nature and has nothing to do with where they are born and raised or their social environment ....

Bruce · **Posted:** Sun Dec 05, 2010 11:17 am

gminer wrote:

Bruce wrote:

gminer wrote:

.. you generally have no idea what you are talking about ... other than your premise is incorrect and your examples do not prove anything in regards to your "black singing voice" theory ..... Take care

You generally and specifically have your head up your arse. Genetics certainly play a part in voices. That's why singers from the same family can sing harmonies (Mills Brothers, Everly Brothers) that can't be done by singers who are not related.

When you show me a white guy who can sing like Howlin' Wolf we'll talk.

needed to do that to get to get a sense of your daily environment ...... so based on your generalizations and stereotyping all blacks would sound the same and all whites would sound the same because of a genetic marker that is unique to people of different skin colours for their singing voice ...... a trained black opera singer would always sound black and easily distinguishable from their white counterpart .... it is, after all, and according to you, genetic in nature and has nothing to do with where they are born and raised or their social environment ....

No, as I said there are exeptions to every rule. Charley Pride sounds like his rural Montana background. Environment is a huge factor also. Many black singers sing in the style that they do because of attending black church services all of their lives. Don't know if you've ever been in a black church (my ex-father-in-law was a black baptist minister), but it's entirely different from a white church.

These genetic markers are not solely based on black and white. The great black sprinters are all of "western" african descent.

Still waiting for the white guy that sounds like howlin' wolf.

I'll believe that these are generalizations and stereotypes when you explain a hopws non-genetic factor that swhy no white sprinter has gotten to the finals of the 100 meter dash in the olympics in the past 30 years.

Obviously genetics are causing differences between blacks and whites that are not in dispute, skin color, hair etc....why does it scare you so much to ponder whether or not genetics can also effect voices, athleic ability, etc...

We also know that genetics affect other things. Blacks are much more likely to get certain diseases, for instance.

What is your environmental explanation for why no white sprinters can compete with the best sprinters in the olympics? The best sprinters are blacks of african descent who grew up in all different environments around the world.

gminer · **Joined:** Mon Oct 11, 2010 6:17 pm **Posts:** 2949

....you are not presenting anything new or unknown other than your assumptions which are incorrect based on your premise that ones singing voice has a unique genetic marker somehow tied to ones skin colour ... you make the statement there are exceptions to the rule as if there is a rule for ones singing voice tied to a specific genetic disposition....... there is only one race and it is the human race ... there is no white or black or yellow or green race .... can you absorb that concept? .... because if a singing voice is genetic then a voice impressionist would not be able to copy a voice outside/beyond their skin colour .... Take care

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zngx_fNfm7I

Bruce · **Posted:** Sun Dec 05, 2010 12:11 pm

gminer wrote:

....you are not presenting anything new or unknown other than your assumptions which are incorrect based on your premise that ones singing voice has a unique genetic marker somehow tied to ones skin colour ... you make the statement there are exceptions to the rule as if there is a rule for ones singing voice tied to a specific genetic disposition....... there is only one race and it is the human race ... there is no white or black or yellow or green race .... can you absorb that concept? .... because if a singing voice is genetic then a voice impressionist would not be able to copy a voice outside/beyond their skin colour .... Take care

Let's hear the impressionist do howlin' wolf.

gminer · **Joined:** Mon Oct 11, 2010 6:17 pm **Posts:** 2949

Bruce wrote:

gminer wrote:

....you are not presenting anything new or unknown other than your assumptions which are incorrect based on your premise that ones singing voice has a unique genetic marker somehow tied to ones skin colour ... you make the statement there are exceptions to the rule as if there is a rule for ones singing voice tied to a specific genetic disposition....... there is only one race and it is the human race ... there is no white or black or yellow or green race .... can you absorb that concept? .... because if a singing voice is genetic then a voice impressionist would not be able to copy a voice outside/beyond their skin colour .... Take care

Let's hear the impressionist do howlin' wolf.

.... send him an email http://www.corporateentertainers.ca/requestform.htm ... after all he only does James Brown, Lou Rawls, the Temptations, Louis Armstrong, Nat King Cole, Natalie Cole, George Benson, Lionel Richie, Tina Turner, Chuck Berry, Barry White, Bob Marley, Ray Charles, The Platters, Chubby Checker, Otis Redding, Michael Jackson, Stevie Wonder, Diana Ross, Sammy Davis Jr and many others ... Take care

Negative Creep · **Joined:** Tue Oct 12, 2010 6:21 pm **Posts:** 13572

ClashWho wrote:

Bruce wrote:

And maybe you're not aware of this, but supposedly Elvis once said....

('The only thing black people can do for me is shine my shoes and buy my music,' he once opined.)”

Bruce, you've been making some good points, but this is unconscionable, especially coming from you of all people. That quote was debunked decades ago, in Jet magazine. Not exactly a white bread publication. I can't believe you're unaware of that, huge Elvis fan that you supposedly are, so why the heck would you perpetuate such a deplorable myth?

http://www.snopes.com/music/artists/presley1.asp

Thank you.
And Mary J. Blige REALLY needs to see that link. Like, immediately. You can't just make up your mind about someone based on a myth. It's absurd.

ClashWho · **Posted:** Sun Dec 05, 2010 6:14 pm

Bruce wrote:

What white voice ever sounded like this....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NCaVU_iNNc0

or like this....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rb0RbiZNqQU

or like this....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=trRJcIDEM_A

or like this...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UP34u6rdscs

You might be right, I don't know, but I think what you're hearing may be down to blacks tending to sing in an affected style due to tradition and the music they grew up with and such. For example, many gay men speak in an affected timbre and cadence that has nothing to do with genetics. It's not like all gay men are related. But we all know that "gay speaking style" when we hear it. Might be the same thing with black singers. Some white people adopt that style of singing, as well. Like Steve Winwood and this guy: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qi9sLkyhhlE

ClashWho · **Posted:** Sun Dec 05, 2010 6:22 pm

gminer wrote:

needed to do that to get to get a sense of your daily environment ...... so based on your generalizations and stereotyping all blacks would sound the same and all whites would sound the same because of a genetic marker that is unique to people of different skin colours for their singing voice ...... a trained black opera singer would always sound black and easily distinguishable from their white counterpart .... it is, after all, and according to you, genetic in nature and has nothing to do with where they are born and raised or their social environment ....

The sound of our voice is determined by the size and shape of our vocal chords, as well as other factors like the mouth, nasal passages, lungs and so on. So it's not impossible for there to be certain characteristics of voice that are more associated with one "race" or another. It's just a wider extrapolation of the reasons that brothers can have such similar voices, and fathers and sons, mothers and daughters, and so on. "Race" is really a misnomer in talking about humans, of course, but what we call "race" is still a collective set of physical characteristics, and it is physical characteristics that determine differences in voices.

gminer · **Joined:** Mon Oct 11, 2010 6:17 pm **Posts:** 2949

ClashWho wrote:

gminer wrote:

needed to do that to get to get a sense of your daily environment ...... so based on your generalizations and stereotyping all blacks would sound the same and all whites would sound the same because of a genetic marker that is unique to people of different skin colours for their singing voice ...... a trained black opera singer would always sound black and easily distinguishable from their white counterpart .... it is, after all, and according to you, genetic in nature and has nothing to do with where they are born and raised or their social environment ....

The sound of our voice is determined by the size and shape of our vocal chords, as well as other factors like the mouth, nasal passages, lungs and so on. So it's not impossible for there to be certain characteristics of voice that are more associated with one "race" or another. It's just a wider extrapolation of the reasons that brothers can have such similar voices, and fathers and sons, mothers and daughters, and so on. "Race" is really a misnomer in talking about humans, of course, but what we call "race" is still a collective set of physical characteristics, and it is physical characteristics that determine differences in voices.

ClashWho · **Posted:** Sun Dec 05, 2010 10:22 pm

Yeah, but, then again...

http://jslhr.highwire.org/cgi/content/abstract/37/4/738

And...

http://www.waisman.wisc.edu/vocal/Durts ... ometry.pdf

gminer · **Joined:** Mon Oct 11, 2010 6:17 pm **Posts:** 2949

ClashWho wrote:

Yeah, but, then again...

http://jslhr.highwire.org/cgi/content/abstract/37/4/738

And...

http://www.waisman.wisc.edu/vocal/Durts ... ometry.pdf

... it is quite difficult when one hears Tom Wait sing and beyond ones wildest imagination to know that his father was of Scots-Irish descent and his mother was Norwegian American ....... it would be interesting to see the result of studies when a person is given up at birth and is raised in a completely different ethinic grouping what changes occur to voice pronounciation and sound ... for example an Asian youngster raised by Scottish parents etc ... Take care

Bruce · **Posted:** Mon Dec 06, 2010 8:36 pm

gminer wrote:

ClashWho wrote:

Yeah, but, then again...

http://jslhr.highwire.org/cgi/content/abstract/37/4/738

And...

http://www.waisman.wisc.edu/vocal/Durts ... ometry.pdf

... it is quite difficult when one hears Tom Wait sing

Is that what you would call what he does? singing? He sounds like one of those guys who had his voice box cut out because of smoking.

I don't get why somebody would want to listen to Tom Waits or Leonard Cohen singing when there are voices like this out there.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uMJ2XH_qHkU

Dreww · **Posted:** Mon Dec 06, 2010 8:41 pm

The better question is why would you want to limit yourself to just one of those three? They are all excellent in their own ways.

Forgotten Son · **Posted:** Mon Dec 06, 2010 9:08 pm

I'm inclined to believe that voice is largely determined by upbringing rather than genetics.

Most Influential Rock Artists

Who is online