Greatest Rock Artists Of All Time (Revision Version)

[Tim]

I'd say initial popularity is a bit of blowout for Chicago even though admittedly Kate's lasting popularity is very good.

[ManPerson]

You could say the same about Phil Collins, Bad Bunny, Hall & Oates, etc.

[Tim]

I guess. I do think Chicago is a bit more influential than artists you cite with their jazz-rock popularization as well as inspiring one of ddd's most prolific posters.

[ManPerson]

Maybe, but I also think Bad Bunny and Hall & Oates at least are also more acclaimed.

[Tim]

Guess I can live with Chicago between Roxys and Genesis. Fido?

131. Frank Zappa
132. Etta James
133. Justin Timberlake
134. Blondie
135. Billy Joel
136. Martha & the Vandellas
137. Iron Maiden
138. Chic
139. Talking Heads
140. The Smiths
141. The Cure
142. Iggy Pop & the Stooges
143. Sex Pistols
144. Oasis
145. Daft Punk
146. TLC
147. Kate Bush
148. Roxy Music
149. Chicago
150. Genesis
151. Eddie Cochran
152. Patti Smith
153. Daryl Hall & John Oates
154. A Tribe Called Quest
155. Lana Del Rey
156. Rush
157. Bad Bunny
158. Phil Collins
159. Ariana Grande
160. Usher

[pauldrach]

Don't you want to list The Mothers of Invention with Zappa?

[Tim]

I guess I went with old Brian's listing but sure I can change it from now on to, say

xxx. Frank Zappa & The Mothers of Invention

[Fido]

I don't know, Chicago doesn't only have initial popularity, they had two decades of constant Gold albums, half of them Platinum, many multi-platinum, with many hits, lots of Grammy noms, Grammy Hall of Fame, Rock Hall, Songwriters Hall of Fame, and various members, esp Kath and Cetera, are very acclaimed by other musicians. I can see them there I guess.

Yes to Zappa & the Mothers.

[ManPerson]

I could see Lana Del Rey a bit higher. I think she takes acclaim and influence over Hall & Oates for instance, due to pioneering the alt-pop genre.

I'd also have Usher higher. When compared to Chicago, for instance, popularity is probably a tie (and may even go to Usher), acclaim would go towards Usher (his musical impact is very strong in its own right), while he's also been cited as an influence by tons of r&b singers in the years since.

[Tim]

Thoughts:

131. Frank Zappa & The Mothers of Invention
132. Etta James
133. Justin Timberlake
134. Blondie
135. Billy Joel
136. Martha & the Vandellas
137. Iron Maiden
138. Chic
139. Talking Heads
140. The Smiths
141. The Cure
142. Iggy Pop & the Stooges
143. Sex Pistols
144. Oasis
145. Daft Punk
146. TLC
147. Kate Bush
148. Roxy Music
149. Usher
150. Chicago
151. Genesis
152. Eddie Cochran
153. Patti Smith
154. Lana Del Rey
155. Daryl Hall & John Oates
156. A Tribe Called Quest
157. Rush
158. Bad Bunny
159. Phil Collins
160. Ariana Grande

[Fido]

Disagree on that Usher bump. His influence comes down to being really successful and achieving crossover success, but he isn't an innovator and has little musical influece to speak of, unlike most of the group he would be jumping over, who are also way more acclaimed. Him being cited by other artists is more musical impact than anything, in which he does very well but not enough to beat people like Tribe or Patti Smith. He doesn't tie or win popularity against Chicago, they have sold more, have better chart success and have achieved that for a longer period of time.

[Tim]

So you'd keep him at bottom? Cause I'd say Ariana, Phil Collins, Bad Bunny, Hall & Oates and, to lesser extent, Chicago aren't particularly musically influential either.

[ManPerson]

I'd argue that Patti Smith and Tribe, who you bring up, beat Chicago in acclaim and influence as well.

[Tim]

Sure there are limits to this logic otherwise: The Clash is more influential and acclaimed than Elton John, same could be said for The Kinks and Public Enemy.

[ManPerson]

Disagree on that Usher bump. His influence comes down to being really successful and achieving crossover success, but he isn't an innovator
Neither are Chicago, necessarily. And most of their influence is in the jazz rock genre, which let's not overblow the importance of in the grand scheme of things.
and has little musical influece to speak of, unlike most of the group he would be jumping over, who are also way more acclaimed. Him being cited by other artists is more musical impact than anything, in which he does very well but not enough to beat people like Tribe or Patti Smith. He doesn't tie or win popularity against Chicago, they have sold more, have better chart success and have achieved that for a longer period of time.

I don't see Chicago's longevity as particularly relevant to the criteria.

In terms of Chicago having better chart success, I'd dispute that they clearly win in that category considering Usher has much stronger chart success in the UK and 6 more number one hits in the US (and that's not even taking into account Usher's success on the r&b charts).

[Tim]

A potential solution:

131. Frank Zappa & The Mothers of Invention
132. Etta James
133. Justin Timberlake
134. Blondie
135. Billy Joel
136. Martha & the Vandellas
137. Iron Maiden
138. Chic
139. Talking Heads
140. The Smiths
141. The Cure
142. Iggy Pop & the Stooges
143. Sex Pistols
144. Oasis
145. Daft Punk
146. TLC
147. Kate Bush
148. Roxy Music
149. Genesis
150. Eddie Cochran
151. Patti Smith
152. Lana Del Rey
153. Daryl Hall & John Oates
154. A Tribe Called Quest
155. Usher/Chicago
156. Chicago/Usher
157. Rush
158. Bad Bunny
159. Phil Collins
160. Ariana Grande

[Fido]

I wouldn't have Usher above Rush, as he only wins popularity. Having Chicago below Hall & Oates would be terrible as I don't think they beat them in anything.

Chicago's longevity is relevant because that's lasting popularity.

[Tim]

Better?

150. Eddie Cochran
151. Patti Smith
152. Lana Del Rey
153. A Tribe Called Quest
154. Chicago
155. Rush
156. Usher
157. Bad Bunny
158. Phil Collins
159. Daryl Hall & John Oates
160. Ariana Grande